CRA Facebook Page

The day to day working of the Caledonian Railway Company, including its constituents and successors.
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Victorian_Lad
Posts: 105
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 9:03 pm

CRA Facebook Page

Post by Victorian_Lad » Sun Oct 07, 2018 10:11 pm

Hello all,
It has come to my attention that there are quite a few CRA members who are interested in a CRA Facebook page, myself included. Is there any chance of making a CRA facebook page? About 10 members are talking about starting one and I told them to wait and ask the CRA officials first about it.
The perks of having a CRA facebook group would be very wise and a good move forward as it has a wider reach and a better way of bringing new members into the fold. The LNWR Society has had a facebook group for more than a year now and has over 1,200 following on that group, they post pictures, models and materials to get people interested in the society and LNWR as a whole. I cant help but see that something like this would be very good for the CRA and make a stable future for the society. To be honest, I dont know many people who use these forums who are under the age of 40 apart from a few people like myself. Having a facebook group will give the CRA a bigger influence, wider reach worldwide and bigger market for selling books and materials.

I know that some of the older gentlemen may not have a facebook or may not be interested in it but I have an idea. Let someone young and will experience run the CRA group on facebook. I myself run several facebook groups related to railways and pregrouping scottish railways. I even run my business off of Facebook. So if I have permission, may I start a CRA facebook group to promote the society and Caledonian Railway. Posting pictures, promoting the books and materials and help bring new members into the association. There are about 10-15 CRA members who agree with this and the CRA needs to think forward for the next 20-60 years. If not, I completely understand and some members would be making a completely different Caledonian Railway facebook group instead that will point to the CRA but will be its own separate entity.
Thank you and God Bless!

Kris

jasp
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2012 5:40 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by jasp » Mon Oct 08, 2018 6:26 am

Kris
Thank you for your posting.
The Committee has looked into this relatively recently but we can do so again.
Jim Pairman
Chairman

tony brenchley
Posts: 297
Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2012 9:36 am

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by tony brenchley » Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:25 am

I suspect I am like many members - I don't use facebook, I don't perceive that have a need for it and consequently I don't know what it involves. I am aware of some of the problems experienced by users.

The obvious question to ask is what would be the effect on the quality of the Forum? Would it add anything without losing what we have? If it does add something can the Forum be modified to accommodate it?

Tony B

Victorian_Lad
Posts: 105
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2017 9:03 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by Victorian_Lad » Mon Oct 08, 2018 10:44 am

I dont believe a CRA Facebook group would actually effect the forum in anyway. The Facebook group would be a way to connect with a broader audience that may no know about this forum or have no interest. This forum although its good for general subjects, does not provide a way to answer peoples questions or talk to people on a more personal level and it can take days to get replies from people or even to get answer you need from a thread, Facebook eliminates that time as you can reply instantly and connect with people better. People would still use the Forum of course but for those who are on facebook, it would be a good way to create a community to share with like minds admirers of the CR. Also, when a new book is released, majority of people never know about it unless you frequent this forum or the website, which the average person who is interested in railway most likely doesnt. With a group, it would be a great way to promote new books and you could possibly see your sales double in profit as the advertising is far greater on facebook.

Kris

dunalastairv
Posts: 191
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2012 7:01 am

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by dunalastairv » Mon Oct 08, 2018 11:18 am

Just to put in my twopen'orth, the main problem here is not whether people use the Forum or Facebook, but how to cater for the large number of C.R.A. members who do not use a computer at all and are thus denied access to both. As one who frequently has difficulties with all this technology, and is often driven to rage by its inconsistencies, I can easily understand the point of view which says 'leave the whole thing alone'; however, if the Forum is to be enhanced by the obvious knowledge and expertise these missing members possess, some method needs to be found to include them...

caley739
Posts: 165
Joined: Sun Apr 28, 2013 6:59 am

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by caley739 » Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:18 pm

I think this is an idea to treat with caution. The forum has been possibly the most useful resource added to our website in recent years. Our members collectively have an enormous reservoir of knowledge on all sorts of subjects.Anything that dilutes or damages the forum is to be avoided.

I am definitely an oldie, have never used facebook and likely never will. It seems that drawbacks may be as numerous as advantages on facebook. Many facebook quotes I have seen make me cringe and my impression is that the general level of debate is pretty shallow, puerile, politically correct, abusive, or even criminal. Is an instant facebook response to a question/request likely to be a worthwhile one? Many such questions/requests require time (more than just days) for thought or research to provide a meaningful response. Sometimes no definite answer can be provided. If anyone is rash enough to post rubbish on the forum it is likely to be quickly challenged, corrected, or at least discussed. Surely any one with even a passing interest in The Caledonian or Scottish railways in general will already be aware of the Association and the forum. In this day and age any search engine will quickly find us.

To be more positive it is important to attract younger members and also to tap into the knowledge of older members who do not use the forum, but how to do it, I'm not sure.

Tom Robertson

Alisdair
Posts: 31
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:22 am

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by Alisdair » Mon Oct 08, 2018 2:59 pm

Despite being a (slightly) younger "older gentleman", I am fairly computer literate so don't have an issue with using Facebook from a technical competence point of view. However, I don't use and will not use Facebook given its Big Brother mentality, but that's my opinion and it's clearly not shared by many people. Fairly recently at a security briefing at my workplace, a straw poll was taken of those present (in the hundreds) and it was clear that I was in a very small minority in staying off Facebook - I would guess less than 10%. So what? It demonstrates that the vast majority of the working population is probably using Facebook.
To ignore this large audience would be foolish. I believe that there's actually nothing stopping anybody setting up a CR Facebook page; indeed, I think somebody might already have done so. If it is done under the aegis of the Association then there would be a way of drawing in members and pointing them in the direction of the Forum for more measured and learned discussion and pointing out the advantages of joining the Association. The moderator would have to have the backing of the Committee and some guidance on how the Association would like the page to be moderated in the Association's interest.
In other words, I am in favour, even if I will not use it myself.
Alisdair

jimwatt2mm
Posts: 627
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:36 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by jimwatt2mm » Mon Oct 08, 2018 3:57 pm

Like Tony, Tom and Alisdair I do not use Facebook or any similar social media (unless RMWeb counts as such), but I would have no objection to the Association making use of it to promote itself and attract new members provided that any bits of useful information which come to light on it can be shared on here and the tone of what is conducted on it does not diminish or damage the reputation and integrity of the CRA.

Jim W

David Elvy
Posts: 440
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 6:26 am

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by David Elvy » Mon Oct 08, 2018 5:51 pm

I use face book purely for wee snippets that come up from time to time, I am not a fan of face book, from my experience quite a bit of time is spent moderating things, something I am happy to say I have never seen needed on our forum.

Their is already a pre-grouping face book forum and one dedicated to the C&O, I recognise some of the benefits but also pitfalls. There was something on face book earlier this or late last year which ended up being removed for reasons unknown to me, I do know that the admin person made a few claims which were inaccurate.

My personal thoughts would be that if a face book page was set up a very clear set of guidelines are first established making it very clear what type correspondence would and would not be acceptable. As face book stuff is open to all in-sundry could I suggest member only information is not published on face book.

Having serious reservations I suggest proceeding with caution.

David

Loch Awe
Posts: 68
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2013 8:26 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by Loch Awe » Mon Oct 08, 2018 6:08 pm

Whilst not wishing to pour cold water on ideas to promote the society I would agree with Alisdair in that I refuse to use Facebook as I consider it highly dangerous in terms of one's personal data. However if others want to use it and it helps promote the Society I have no personal objection. I think we shouldn't lose sight of the high quality information information exchange we already have here. The only things that doesn't give it a full 10 out of 10 for me is a size restriction on attachments. I'm not sure how the RMWeb folk can allow bigger attachments, but it is very handy, and would make it easier for me to post drawings, without trying to work out how to downsize the image.

kind regards,

Robert

JimG
Posts: 257
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2012 11:15 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by JimG » Mon Oct 08, 2018 7:31 pm

I'm an oldie who was persuaded to go on to Facebook by my family a year or so ago. I find that it is really just a contact medium and if anything of interest pops up I try and reference it outside Facebook so that I don't have to go digging through all its content to find it again. I certainly wouldn't like to carry out a lengthy technical discussion on it as we often do on this forum. A Facebook group might be a good form of advertising which could direct interested parties to this forum and the Asdsociation web site.

Jim.

dumb buffer
Posts: 499
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2012 10:13 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by dumb buffer » Mon Oct 08, 2018 9:20 pm

As an "Old Fogey" who does not wish to stand in the way of progress, but who is hampered by a lack of understanding, I'd be grateful for a clear understanding of what facebook is and does, in particular what it does better than this forum.

Like, I suspect, many other old fogeys, I am nervous about the new, and particularly suspicious about anything which requires me to "enrol". I would like someone to explain how facebook works and what it does (in terms I can understand).

Why do so many members (reportedly) prefer to use facebook? We have about 440 members and about 233 members of this forum. There are about 370 members with email addresses. Every new member is specifically invited to join the forum, but I don't know how many do so. It would be interesting to know how many members are facebook users.

I take the point made earlier about the impressions given to outsiders. Therefore it is desirable that any facebook page should be controlled on behalf of the Association. Can this be done?

I suspect that many of the existing members of committee, and the Association are, like me, old fogeys, and are therefore unlikely to look kindly on such an innovation -- which doesn't make it a BAD THING.

I hope an instructive and open debate can be had.

Allan Ferguson

David Thorpe
Posts: 57
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2014 5:58 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by David Thorpe » Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:16 pm

I am not on Facebook but my wife is. It seems to me that it is good for keeping in touch with family and friends (and their friends and their friends and their friends....). It may well be good for advertising the existence of the Association, but as JimG says it's unlikely to be any good at all for quality technical discussions. I have been a member of a forum where the introduction of a relevant Facebook page eventually diminished the forum membership to such an extent that the forum eventually closed down - a great pity because I thought the Facebook page was just a dumbed down and wholly inadequate alternative although it seemed to suit many of today's internet users. I personally do not see much likelihood of people who are drawn to and like Facebook also then joining and appreciating a forum such as this.

DT

Alan K
Posts: 339
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:41 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by Alan K » Wed Oct 10, 2018 7:05 pm

I agree with Alisdair. Facebook is a reality. It might attract a lot of dross but might nevertheless draw in more serious interest from others. I would have thought that it would be in the CRA's interest to have an 'official' Facebook group so that some form of control of content can be exercised. But I'm unsure how that can be done. For example, is a moderator role possible, and what powers does it have?
I do have a Facebook account, but seldom use it and have little interest in it. I'm almost certainly also in the 'Old Fogey' camp, but I did use computers at work quite a lot before I retired, so I would consider myself reasonably computer literate. Apart from the Facebook issue, I'm concerned about Dunalastairv's comment about CRA members who do not use the computer - not only are they missing out with content from this forum, but we are missing out on any contribution which they could otherwise make. Is there a potential project here to try to attract them?

Alan

Dave John
Posts: 198
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2012 7:42 am

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by Dave John » Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:58 pm

I can see the advantage of a CRA Facebook account as a front page to introduce the CRA to a perhaps younger audience who might go on to become members. I'd agree that facebook is not a good medium for technical discussions and that whoever was running the facebook page would have to keep a tight reign on all the rubbish that can happen on there.

My facebook account is currently moribund as a result of some hacking attempts a few years ago and I really can't see a good reason for reviving it.

Irnorman
Posts: 8
Joined: Sat Jul 02, 2016 8:35 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by Irnorman » Mon Oct 29, 2018 2:00 pm

I don’t fall into to the old fogey category yet, but don’t use any of the mainstream social media apps, purely because I don’t agree with their T&Cs. From the following link published on 27th October 2018 (my bold)

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/ ... -life.html

“Facebook
With over a billion users, Facebook is the definitive homepage for many web users. Its terms of service, data use and cookie use policy span more than 14,000 words over eight separate pages and would take even the quickest reader more than two hours to dig through. But what rights have you handed over to Facebook?
Specifically for photos and video uploaded to the site, Facebook has a license to use your content in any way it sees fit, with a license that goes beyond merely covering the operation of the service in its current form. Facebook can transfer or sub-license its rights over a user’s content to another company or organisation if needed. Facebook’s license does not end upon the deactivation or deletion of a user’s account, content is only released from this license once all other users that have interacted with the content have also broken their ties with it (for example, a photo or video shared or tagged with a group of friends).”

Facebook has the potential to be a positive tool. I’m just not convinced people understand, or possibly know, what they agree to when joining.
Ian Norman

David Elvy
Posts: 440
Joined: Tue Aug 21, 2012 6:26 am

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by David Elvy » Wed Oct 31, 2018 5:41 pm

Irnorman wrote:I don’t fall into to the old fogey category yet, but don’t use any of the mainstream social media apps, purely because I don’t agree with their T&Cs. From the following link published on 27th October 2018 (my bold)

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/ ... -life.html

“Facebook
With over a billion users, Facebook is the definitive homepage for many web users. Its terms of service, data use and cookie use policy span more than 14,000 words over eight separate pages and would take even the quickest reader more than two hours to dig through. But what rights have you handed over to Facebook?
Specifically for photos and video uploaded to the site, Facebook has a license to use your content in any way it sees fit, with a license that goes beyond merely covering the operation of the service in its current form. Facebook can transfer or sub-license its rights over a user’s content to another company or organisation if needed. Facebook’s license does not end upon the deactivation or deletion of a user’s account, content is only released from this license once all other users that have interacted with the content have also broken their ties with it (for example, a photo or video shared or tagged with a group of friends).”

Facebook has the potential to be a positive tool. I’m just not convinced people understand, or possibly know, what they agree to when joining.
Ian, thank you for sharing that wee snippet of information, I doubt there are many folk that are aware of this.

David

jasp
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2012 5:40 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by jasp » Wed Oct 31, 2018 9:42 pm

I have received a response from Kris which I will forward to Committee members for their thoughts, prior to progressing this.
Jim P
Chairman

jasp
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2012 5:40 pm

Re: CRA Facebook Page

Post by jasp » Fri Dec 14, 2018 6:41 pm

The Committee have looked closely at this and, while we are not willing to have an “Official” Facebook page are happy to have a link to the CRA website on it and complement Kris (Victorian lad) on his work
The question of using photographs from TTL and publications is still of great concern, given Facebook’s policy on material posted thereon.
If individuals wish to post material from any or all CRA sources then permission of the owner of the material must be sought, in advance.
On the plus side,there is a considerable amount of CR material available on the web so we do not consider the above policy to be detrimental to the workings of such a Facebook page.
We look forward to seeing things develop.
Jim P
Chairman

For those interested, the page is “Caledonian Railway Enthusiast Group”

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