Dundee & Arbroath Signalbox and location.

Any aspect related to the structures and equipment on the Caledonian Railway Company.
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Niall Ferguson
Posts: 78
Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 10:23 am

Dundee & Arbroath Signalbox and location.

Post by Niall Ferguson »

This image, provided for the forthcoming book by Alan Brotchie, purports to show a train on the section of the Dundee & Arbroath Ry that ran alongside Dock Street in Dundee. That being so, the locomotive is running southbound with Dock Street to the left and Dundee harbour not visible to the right. The locomotive is NBR Class D31 4-4-0 No.740. Most of the carriages appear to be NBR (judging by their roof profile) except the leading carriage. If the locomotive is heading south from Aberdeen, why is it carrying an "Aberdeen" headboard? What is the signal box visible behind the train - Carolina Port Box?
Niall Ferguson
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jimwatt2mm
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Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2012 5:36 pm

Re: Dundee & Arbroath Signalbox and location.

Post by jimwatt2mm »

I'm not familiar with the signal boxes in the area, but the photo would appear to have been taken from the bridge at the lower left on this map.
Picture1.png
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https://maps.nls.uk/view/82884870

Doesn't explain why it's carrying an Aberdeen headboard, though!

Jim
Niall Ferguson
Posts: 78
Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 10:23 am

Re: Dundee & Arbroath Signalbox and location.

Post by Niall Ferguson »

Thanks, Jim, that was well thought out
Niall
John Duffy
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Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:02 pm

Re: Dundee & Arbroath Signalbox and location.

Post by John Duffy »

There are a couple of interesting things that I note in this thread. The first being that the footbridge, or at least a footbridge was still there in recent times. I must go past and see if it remains.
E_Dock_St_-_Google_Maps.jpg
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I had also not realised that the extension of East Dock Street was built much later than the surrounding roads. The extension to the junction with Broughty Ferry Road lifted the road up around 60' and cleared the down line sidings. Roodyards Bridge would have been added at the same time and later those siding were replaced with large oil storage tanks.

I once had to deal with a BMW whose driver had come down this slope too fast, failed to take the corner and had ended up in a heap in the middle of the railway line. It made quite a change, cutting someone out of their car whilst standing in the middle of a railway line instead of a road!

Is there an indication of what purpose the 'down' line sidings were for? It looks like it might be related to the rock face here, possibly quarrying? The eastern end of these sidings was to be the location of the junction for the Dundee Suburban Railway.

John
Graham R
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Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:44 am

Re: Dundee & Arbroath Signalbox and location.

Post by Graham R »

The down line siding beneath Carolina House orphanage was known as the “Prannie Pond” siding and was termed a ballast siding when opened in the 1890s. It lasted until the late 50s/early60s and I think was a dump site for spent ballast and possibly engine ashes. It was worked by a padlocked ground frame I think.

Regards
Graham
John Duffy
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Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 11:02 pm

Re: Dundee & Arbroath Signalbox and location.

Post by John Duffy »

John Duffy wrote: Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:06 am There are a couple of interesting things that I note in this thread. The first being that the footbridge, or at least a footbridge was still there in recent times. I must go past and see if it remains.
It does indeed still exist. It remains as per the photograph, sadly out of use.
Graham R
Posts: 97
Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2013 8:44 am

Re: Dundee & Arbroath Signalbox and location.

Post by Graham R »

Going back to the photo of the train with the Aberdeen headboard perversely spotted on the Up line at Dundee … there are a couple of things: wherever it has travelled from, it has not come far (the tender is full), and it has been prepared for this duty in a hurry (it sports Express Passenger discs but also has a single lamp above the right buffer-beam, which was a Class D goods code, in LNE days at least; or perhaps it is a shunting code).

I wonder if this loco could have been under preparation at Tay Bridge shed for an Aberdeen duty, then dispatched instead to rescue an Up train whose loco had failed with a hot bearing or other malady requiring its removal from the train. If so, they had time to turn the rescue engine, either at Tay Bridge shed or at Dundee East station, which also had a turntable tucked behind Camperdown Junction signal box.

Not a totally convincing theory, but I can’t offer a better one.

Regards
Graham
Jim Summers
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Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:54 pm

Re: Dundee & Arbroath Signalbox and location.

Post by Jim Summers »

I had occasion in another place recently to muse that a Caley semaphore indication in a picture was nonsense because the fireman had set it the opposite way round. An inexperienced man might.

Could something similar be the case with the destination on this loco?
We have all seen nonsense with modern digital displays, and human beings being what they are, it might well have happened in truly digital days (i.e. manually manipulated indications).

It seems unlikely, I agree, but just maybe.

JimS
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