812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

To assist modellers plan and build a Caledonian Railway layout with the appropriate stock. A list/catalogue of supplies and components is available to members in the Association Resources section of the Forum below.
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Buhar
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2012 6:32 pm

812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by Buhar »

Members may be interested in the preparation of a 3D printed model of the 812 Class and also the 652 variant with the amended cab side-sheets. Gavin (known as "Knuckles" on RMWeb) has previously done a couple of Furness engines which were (and probably still are) available though Shapeways. Increasingly frustrated with Shapeways pricing and irrational changes to tolerances he has bought his own resin printer which cures the layers by UV light. This gives a much smoother finish (not sheet-material standard of course) and has given Gavin much more control of the process. He is now selling direct (or rather printing to order). Previous models have had a 3D printed chassis but I know that going the etched route is planned.

I am aware that Caley Coaches have had an etched 812 for years but have indicated that the Rails model will probably see the end of that. I don't think this venture would impact on Jim's remaining sales as those who would choose a high quality etched kit would probably not opt for a 3D print instead.

I've not bought from the man yet (I was not a fan of the Shapeways output) but I have been following developments on his thread and bunged him some prototype info on the 812. The thread is at https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index ... nt=3640577

I know Gavin is keen on getting things right, so will welcome any comments or suggestions. He models in both 00 and S4 so I suspect all three 4mm variants will be taken into account. If anyone is minded to get in touch directly his email is [email protected]

I have no stake in this venture, although if it looks good I will certainly get a couple, my enlightened self-interest in bringing this to the forum is the production of an accurate model.

Alan
lindsay_g
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:43 pm

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by lindsay_g »

What a strange choice of prototype to create a 3D print in, given that there is already an etched kit for both variants and soon a ready to run model for the 812. The quality of either would be superior and the effort to take a 3D print to the state of a working model will be far far greater. The logic defeats me.

Lindsay
tony brenchley
Posts: 316
Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2012 9:36 am

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by tony brenchley »

Seeing these posts and with reference to the proposed Rails of Sheffield Class 812 model I have tried to open a dialogue with R o S to try to ensure they don't produce a ready to run model that is difficult to convert to P4 standards.

The Hornby LSWR class 600 will just about accept P4 wheels but the wheel splashers on their NBR J36 are set too narrow and will only accept P4 wheel sets with some fairly major surgery. R o S acknowledged my enquiry and promised to forward it to whoever is organising the manufacture. It is now a few weeks since this contact and the absence of a reply is now further incentive for me to chase this up.

Has any body else had contact with R o S about their model?

Tony B
Buhar
Posts: 3
Joined: Sat Dec 01, 2012 6:32 pm

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by Buhar »

Lindsay, you're right if the project is looked at from anything approaching a commercial perspective, however the cost and accessibility of processes like the Portrait cutter, 3D printing, bespoke laser cutting and etching have all led to small-scale production or one-off items. Additionally, doing the designs and using the equipment have probably become aspects of the hobby in their own right in that people take enjoyment from the process as well as the outcome.

That's my own take. Gavin and I have corresponded about the project and he pointed out that he wanted at least four 812s for himself (he already has a couple of Caley Coaches etched kits awaiting building), has his own printer and so doing the design was cost-effective from the start. A 3D design also gives the opportunity to re-scale pretty quickly and with this particular loco there are some kith and kin that could be accommodated with fairly minor tweaks.

The body is now available in two styles, riveted and the purer un-riveted CR version and the purchaser is invited to specify their gauge so the splashers can be set correctly. There are three types of smokebox door available and either Ramsbottom or Ross pop valves. There is no top lamp iron as it won't print there, so that will need to be a wee bit of etch and also no washin'-hoose contraption is provided. The tender is likely to be a 3000gal version initially but that's not done yet.

Herewith are some pictures, please note the colour images are screenshots of the 3D design, not an actual model and the one in blue has the wrong smokebox door for that period. The other images are of actual prints.
812a.jpg
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812c.jpg
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812d.jpg
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812e.jpg
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812b1.jpg
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The cost of the body is £44.89 with £5.00 p+p from [email protected].

As I said previously, I am not yet even a customer of Gavin's, let alone having any financial interest in the concern. If any issues are spotted with the design please e-mail Gavin (the boiler bands have already been thinned to 0.1mm from the previous 0.2mm) it seems amendments can be made pretty much on-the-hoof.

Alan
caleyJim
Posts: 44
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:10 pm

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by caleyJim »

While I am biased as the owner of Caley Coaches Ltd. I too find the choice of prototype baffling, not because of the kit in the Caley Coaches range which I realise is not for everyone but because of the forthcoming Rails/Bachmann model.

In reply to the comment "Caley Coaches have had an etched 812 for years but have indicated that the Rails model will probably see the end of that": The kit will continue to be available as long as there is demand but it has to be said that sales have dried up to a trickle since the announcement of the RTR model. Being only a small concern, it is not possible to hold stocks of slow selling lines (which would consume scarce capital) and the decision to pull the plug may have to be made at some time in the future. If that does happen, plenty of notice will be given.

Jim
Coronach
Posts: 155
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:41 am

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by Coronach »

Basically, the guy doing them wanted a pair for his own project but seeing the interest has offered it to a wider audience and let's be honest, it's a type we could never have enough, I suspect!

Davy
caleyJim
Posts: 44
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:10 pm

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by caleyJim »

Looking at sales of the various products in the Caley Coaches range, and given the availability of the very nice Sparkshot products not to mention the impending Bachmann product, I think the time has come to call it a day for CL02 :!: . I still have a small stock but do not propose restocking once these are sold. I have some chassis etches available on the site if anyone wants to try it under the Sparkshot body.
lindsay_g
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:43 pm

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by lindsay_g »

Sorry to hear that, Jim.

I think it will be a great loss if your 812/652 kit disappears from the market. However, supply of anything has to be balanced with demand for that item and if it indeed proves the case that there's much more appetite for the Bachmann and Sparkshot items then it is commercial folly to keep trying to offer an alternative. I'd give it time, but if not I'd suggest CRA and other readers start getting orders in.

A picture tells a thousand words. Everyone just feast your eyes :

3 CC Kits in a row.jpg
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These 3 absolute beauties were built by Steve Duckworth for 2 members of our association (I haven't asked their permission so won't identify them) from the Caley Coaches kits. That is what we'll be missing. There was obviously a bit extra work beyond the kit to end up with specific examples of the prototype, but you can visualise how good a kit can look without the further customisation. Even without having the alternatives to hand as yet, there's absolutely no way they could be upgraded to the standards of the above. Much of that stems from the slenderness of parts that can be achieved from brass or nickel silver etched material which synthetic materials cannot get anywhere near replicating.

We'll have to wait and see what the other offerings look like and how they replicate the prototype in both accuracy and detail. From memory we'll find the Sparkshot 3D print with lamp irons approaching scale 3" thick and lack of finesse equally elsewhere. The Bachmann offering, from memory again, is CR 828 in its various incarnations, so 652 versions don't enter the frame at all, and other 812's in their goods guises and lack of Westinghouse equipment might be well short of what everyone might want. We can only wait and see. However, my money is on them having the same lack of delicateness that whitemetal kits had long before the introduction of etched offerings. I expect that the Bachmann will be far superior to the Sparkshot in quality, and with the latter you've still got to scratch build everything that will attach beneath it and drive it.

I'm glad I've got one of Jim's kits, part built, and look forward to completing it. Just wish I had the time to keep everything progressing towards completion at the one time.

Lindsay
Coronach
Posts: 155
Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:41 am

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by Coronach »

I do actually have one of your 812 chassis, built to EM, ostensibly for another project but lilely to end up under one of these bodies.
Even if you do pull the kit, Jim, it may still make some sense to keep the chassis available for a bit.
I doubt the Rails chassis will be an easy conversion either.

Davy.
caleyJim
Posts: 44
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:10 pm

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by caleyJim »

Just to keep folks informed, we're down to 2 CL02 Class 812 kits now. Chassis and tender kits will remain available but I'm still not convinced about the full kit.

Jim. www.caley.com
Orbiston
Posts: 49
Joined: Fri Jun 13, 2014 3:57 pm

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by Orbiston »

I've been mulling in my head that we could increase our locomotive stock by building condensing versions of other kits. To my eyes the difference is a couple of pipes, a U shaped effort on top of the bunker and an L shaped one on the boiler. Could this 3D printing produce these and how can I have them drawn. I can hopefully fund this and is it something the society could stock for members? Just musing.
caleyJim
Posts: 44
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:10 pm

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by caleyJim »

If it helps, I can make the condensing fittings from the Class 1 kit available to interested parties.
Orbiston
Posts: 49
Joined: Fri Jun 13, 2014 3:57 pm

Re: 812/652 Class 3D Prints in development

Post by Orbiston »

Even better - I'll be in touch
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