Class 488 Build

How to do it, advice sought and offered.
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lindsay_g
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:43 pm

Class 488 Build

Post by lindsay_g »

Hi all,

I've started a thread on the Scalefour Society Forum regarding the build of a class 488 which you can find here . Everyone should be able to access it as it's not in a members only area. It's part of a challenge during lockdown hence why I'm reporting it on that forum. I'll not replicate everything on this Forum and won't constantly tell everyone when I've provided an update. However, I'll update here when any milestones are reached.

It might help anyone with one of the etches secreted in a drawer somewhere (I know of 2 gents with unstarted etches and one who has a partial build). Any questions or comments arising out of the build can be posted here.

Cheers,

Lindsay
Alan K
Posts: 356
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:41 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by Alan K »

Hi Lindsay
Re the holes in the front of the cab, aren't the outer two for the pipes leading to the clack valves on each side and the middle one to the whistle? I can't see that this is offset to one side: if you look at the NRM photos of 1168 at Beattock and 1167 at Perth Old Shed, it looks to me that this is clearly in the middle. Re the easing lever, I'm not convinced that this passes through into the cab - can't see why it should. If it was to activate it there would need to be a slot not just a hole surely? Apart from that any easy way for the driver to mess with increasing pressure was frowned upon - later designs of the Ramsbottom had a protective skirt to prevent drivers from putting weights on to increase pressure!

Alan
lindsay_g
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:43 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by lindsay_g »

Hi Alan,

The 2 outer holes are for the clacks and seem positioned correctly. However, as to the centre hole, I have several high resolution images of 1167 and here's one that shows both holes for the whistle and lever:

Cab holes.jpg
Cab holes.jpg (44.07 KiB) Viewed 1534 times
I could have expanded one sentence in the update in question to say that the whistle may not have been offset when originally outshopped as the valve lever pointed to the front of the loco and so wouldn't have conflicted with the whistle (but I have no images of 488 or any of the others in that early incarnation that show enough to tell), so the centre hole might have been correct for the original whistle position.

Whilst I've shown that image above, I'm thinking of using a course-sized Markits handrail knob to create the fitting to the Westinghouse (nearest the camera). A 7mm handrail knob could be the basis for the clack fitting just behind it. Can anyone tell me what the diameter is on the ball shape on 7mm knobs? Might anyone have a couple spare if they're a suitable size? (I'll pay or barter. Or point me in the direction of a stockist).

Cheers,

Lindsay
Alan K
Posts: 356
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:41 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by Alan K »

Well that demolishes my argument rather convincingly! I hadn't realised that the offset you meant for the whistle was just a little. And it's clear from your enlargement that the driver did have the ability to at least 'tickle' the safety valves although probably not enough to interfere with them.

Alan
Alan K
Posts: 356
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:41 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by Alan K »

Re the issue of the lever 'pointing the other way', thanks to our new photo data base I've found another example albeit not for the same class but for another Neilson built engine. This was no. 141 (built 1873). The Neilson builder's photo can be seen at File Name Mills 4_2_3_033. But the interesting photo is File Name T060622(1).jpg, which shows the same engine in 1877 in CR livery (and after it had been renumbered 516), and the releasing lever is still the same. JF McEwen's comment (Locomotives of the Caledonian Railway (31) ) is 'the cock's comb of the Ramsbottom safety valve was however placed away from the driver just in case of a temptation to get a little more pressure' !

Alan
dalziel
Posts: 45
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2012 4:28 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by dalziel »

Hi,
I have been following this with interest having two sets of John's 7mm scale etches, one of each batch to build. I have a large and very clear full side on view primt of 488, possibly in works grey, which clearly shows a quite short safety valve release lever pointing forwards to the dome and a print of 169, from the second batch with separate splashers which shows the release lever pointing towards the cab and possibly through the front cab sheet. So no consistency, underlines the need to refer to photos of the loco you are building.

David Gallacher.
lindsay_g
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:43 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by lindsay_g »

I wasn't aware that there was an etch for the second batch. Did he produce that in 4mm as well? Not that I'll be looking out for one, but would be interesting to see that slight variation built.

Lindsay
dalziel
Posts: 45
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2012 4:28 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by dalziel »

Hi Lindsay,
Sorry, not being a 4mm modeller I don't know whether etches for 490-491 were produced in 4mm scale but definitely were in 7mm scale with etched frames for each version reflecting the difference in their overall length. 488/9 is still a work in progress, I have not yet got to 490/91, I'm currently building a 631 class long boiler 0-6-0 with an 1840 gallon 6 wheel tender. I will watch your build of 488 with interest.

David G.
Alan K
Posts: 356
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 9:41 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by Alan K »

Your 488 is looking good Lindsay. The Ramsbottom safety valve looks impressive!


Alan
lindsay_g
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:43 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by lindsay_g »

Thanks Alan, build of the safety valve was rather fun.

I've now had to leave the body at the stage that's it's reached and have now started the chassis , with yet another few uses for the Silhouette Cutter being found.

Lindsay
lindsay_g
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 8:43 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by lindsay_g »

I've continued with the build of 1167 documenting it here on the Scalefour Society Forum. It's now sitting on all 8 wheels but several discrepancies on the etch were discovered which has put things back somewhat.

I wonder if these errors are also present on the 7mm scale etches?

Lindsay
dalziel
Posts: 45
Joined: Mon Aug 20, 2012 4:28 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by dalziel »

Hi Lindsay,
Bearing in mind that John was 7mm fine scale modeller whose primary interest was in the early years both well tank versions were most likely done for himself and I would presume that the 4mm etches were shot down from the 7mm artwork by request of some of his customers. The splasher sides fold up from the footplate and in 7mm fine scale there is JUST sufficient space to accommodate Slaters wheel sets, not much clearance so I can see why it would not work in EM, P4 or Scaleseven. An JB 7mm scale drawing of most of the front elevation shows outside of splasher to outside of splasher as 5’-9” Comparing this with the 631 class which is contemporary, from a copy of the GA drawing , the 631 platform is 7’-4” wide with the front buffer beam front plate width of 8’-3” lining up with the overall outside cylinder width and the rear plate of the sandwich the same width as the platform with the intermediate wooden filler tapered at the ends. The drawings in The ‘Formative Years’ book suggest that the 488 boiler centre line height was 6’-6”with platform height of 4’-1” so 2’-5” from platform to centre line of boiler which matches the etch for the smoke box front reasonably well, outside boiler diameter 4’-6” (ish?) Unfortunately GA drawings for some of the early stuff don’t seem to exist so perhaps an educated guess is the best there is!
Jim Summers
Posts: 874
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2012 8:54 pm

Re: Class 488 Build

Post by Jim Summers »

Just for the record, I can confirm that John's artwork was shot down to 4mm, by John, along with 0-4-0ST no.140 of 1853 and 0-4-0T no. 583A .
Together they formed a fine jigsaw on one etched sheet, and I had to enlist the assistance of the late Peter Johnson and his 7mm versions to understand what was which on the etch. I have a half-finished no.140, which really deserves some attention in this lockdown.

If I recall, a dozen copies of the etch were made. We certainly managed to dispose of them all.

Lindsay's work is a delight to behold.

JimS
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